When I got to work this morning there was a DVD and some pamphlets from Answers in Genesis on my desk. The owner the company and I have had a few friendly discussions about our views on the age of the Earth over the last few months. He is a firm believer in a young Earth, A Global Flood, basically He takes the whole book of Genesis in a very literal sense. That’s fine. I may personally believe in an old Earth, but I am open to the possibility that I am wrong. Besides as a said in an earlier post I think to argue about the Age of the Earth misses the point.
It didn’t take long before my boss, another coworker (who has had face to face conversations with both Ken Ham, and Hugh Ross), and I were involved in a friendly debate. I have been off work sick for three days, so I had a pile of work on my desk to do, and I didn’t feel like getting into it. Besides I am tired of arguing with other Christian about issues like this. I ended making the statement that while Christians are wasting time debating the age of the Earth and other pet doctrines, There is a world of people out there who haven’t heard the Gospel!
My boss made the statement that if Genesis wasn’t literally true then he couldn’t trust the Bible and he wouldn’t even want to read it to his children. Basically for him if his literalist interpretation of Genesis isn’t true, his faith in the whole of Scripture would fail. He views the doctrine of Creation as a brick instead of a spring. And if that brick is missing- then the whole wall falls.
In his book Velvet Elvis, Rob Bell talks about looking at Christian Doctrines as either springs on a trampoline or as bricks in a wall.
If we view a doctrine as a spring, Bell says that “We can take it out and examine it. Discuss it, probe it, question it. It flexes, and it stretches.” According to Bell, the problem with viewing doctrines as bricks is “a brick is fixed in size. It can’t flex or change size, because if it does, then it can’t fit into the wall. What happens then is that the wall becomes the sum total of the beliefs, and God becomes as big as the wall. But God is bigger than any Wall.” And he also says “if you pull one out, the whole wall starts to crumble. It appears quite strong and rigid, but if you begin to rethink or discuss even one brick, the whole thing is in danger.”
I am in the process of coming out of such a “bricky” view of the Christian Faith, I hope that more Christians will stop defending their walls, and start inviting others to Jump on the Trampoline with them.
” I am far more interested in jumping than I am in arguing about whose trampoline is better. You rarely defend the things you love. You enjoy them and tell others about them and invite others to enjoy them with you.”
Rob Bell- Velvet Elvis pg. 27
Filed under: Christianity, Creationism, Emerging Church, Faith, God, Rob Bell, Theology, Thoughts, Uncategorized | Tagged: Emergent Church, religion, Uncategorized, Velvet Elvis
How does the view of the virgin birth “flex”? How does the view of a God in three persons “flex”…how do you jump on that? If these issues are flexible then we have some serious problems!
One more thing. What holds up a trampoline? A Firm, solid, never moving foundation (frame) of steel pipes. The only reason a trampoline can flex is because certian parts NEVER move! they are stable so lesser parts can move! think about this…
p.s. Please respond.
Thanks!
Jason, Thank you for your comments. I agree that in order for a trampoline to work properly there has to be pats that are firm and do not move. Things like
The Existence of God
The inspiration of Scripture
The Deity & Resurrection of Jesus
The Fact that God Created the Universe
The Trinity
And I could list a few more.
I believe that even some of these, while unbreakable, are flexible. Take the doctrine of the Trinity. I am a Christian and I believe that the Bible clearly reveals the truth about the Triune nature of God. But I see this doctrine as flexible. I say this because I understand that my understanding of this triune nature is limited.
I have heard several analogies or descriptions of the Trinity. They all differ slightly on the exact nature of the Relationship of the Father, The Son, And The Holy Spirit. But I see them all as valid and useful attempts of humans with finite understanding, to describe an infinite God.
I agree that certain truths are not Flexible. But for me the list is smaller than it used to be.
i truly believe that the only way to search for the living God is to be open for new ideas and different perspectives.IF we already had all the answers what would be left for us to seek.The fact that God tells us to seek him with all our heart is mabe his way of teaching us to get to know him personaly,When we know someone or something they are a part of our lives and that is how we learn to love.”Be confident of this very thing, That he who has begun a good work among you will bring it to completion by the day of Jesus Christ.And I pray that your love may abound more and more in knowledge and in all judgment,that you may approve things that are excellent.that you may be sincere and without offense till the day of Christ,being filled with the friuts of righteousness,which are from Jesus Christ, to the glory and praise of God”. Philippians 1:6
Aaron-
I agree with you that we must search for God…but I struggle with your comment, “the only way to search for the living God is to be open for new ideas and different perspectives.” God has given us His primary means of revelation- Scripture. (Notice I said primary not only) It is in Scriptures that we search and more accurately allow IT to search us and dictate for us how we will think and live. History has given us hundreds of heresies, tons of lazy theology and plenty of genuinely good hearted, yet misinformed understandings of Scripture. History has also given us a clear working out of these “new ideas” and “perspectives” and laid before us a clear understanding of what fits with Scripture and what doesn’t. Anything “new” going on today is simply a recycling of something “old” from the past. Look at the History of thought in the church…it’s on a cycle…nothing new…simply the same old thoughts re-packaged and slightly altered for this generation. Scripture is a closed book, nothing new is going to come from it…God revealed himself and he is satisfied in that revelation. Question- What new ideas and/or perspectives do we currently need to seek? As you say, “IF we already had all the answers what would be left for us to seek?” I’m not talking about “Traditions” and “practices” in how we carry out a church service or anything like that. I’m talking about how we approach the living God who is unchanging and has been and will be consistent in the revelation of Himself.
Jason-
You commented on your thought about the Trinity by saying, “I say this because I understand that my understanding of this triune nature is limited.” Amen to that. All of our understanding on the triune nature of God is limited. But how SPECIFICLY is it flexible? Your answer on that topic seems to be a bit of a broad brush stroke that doesn’t really get to the core of what your intending to say. Can you clarify? Here’s my deal, no one can give me a good example of a theological category that could be proven inaccurate and thus needed to be altered or destroyed. You said, “I agree that certain truths are not Flexible. But for me the list is smaller than it used to be”. So, what truths are and are not flexible? You must define your terms. Massive strokes of the theological brush do little good and historically speaking-much harm. Also, who says you can’t pluck out a brick from a wall of theology and analyze it? Rob’s analogy is weak…I have no problem with discussion, probing and even cracking a brick open to see its core. Yes, historically speaking people have used their theology as a wall to hide behind and throw bricks from…BUT a negative side of any theological approach can be found, exploited and used to prove a given argument. Simply put…you can only flex and look at a spring for so long before you’re going to have to make a decision on what it is! You can’t have a conversation about something forever…eventually some concrete truths must be arrived at. The revelation of God in scripture has been analyzed and probed for a long time…based on history and your own searching of God (in scripture) what conclusions have you made?
Thanks for the clarification and continued dialog.
Sorry Jenny…
I thought the post said Aaron at the top…
So Aaron should say Jenny!
The second paragraph is missing the heading…
It’s for moveintothehood
Jason,
Thank you for the continued conversation. I dont have time right now to say much. I will say more later. Just a note the comment did say Aaron at first. That comment was posted by my wife and my name was put in there automatically and she didn’t know how to change it.
Jason,
I agree with you that Bell’s analogy isn’t perfect. In fact almost all analogies break down at some point. I like the analogy of a trampoline because it is something that is useless unless you use it. It’s the same way Scripture. It isnt very benificial unless we put it in to practice. You said “no one can give me a good example of a theological category that could be proven inaccurate and thus needed to be altered or destroyed.” I can think of at least one. I would say the modern Church’s (at least the American Evangelical church) portrayal of the Gospel is inaccurate or at least incomplete. I know that this is a bit of a generalization and is not true of all churches, but it seems to me that the Gospel that has been preached is basically this- God sent His son Jesus to die on the cross for my sins. If I confess my sins and ask Jesus into my heart. I get to go to Heaven. That is basically the Gospel in a nutshell as I grew up hearing it. As I have been studying the Gospel of Mark and other Scriptures. I see that Gospel does involve the forgiveness of personal Sins but it involves SO MUCH MORE than that. It brings Restoration, Wholeness, Peace, and Healing in this life. The Gospel shouldn’t be good news for only the person who receives Christ, but also everyone that person comes in contact with. I dont really want to get into listing what truths are flexible and what isnt. I’m tired of lists. It seems like everyone has a different list. I already made my list in my last comment. You asked “based on history and your own searching of God (in scripture) what conclusions have you made? ” I have made many conclusions but i will end with a deep theological truth I learned in Sunday School
“Jesus Love Me This I Know, For The Bible Tells Me So
Hi! Sometimes I can’t help but surrender to my quickest guerrilla I have a joke for you =) How does Michael Jackson pick his nose? From a catalog.